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Plato and Aristotle

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David Tang

PostPosted: Wed Apr 24, 2019 12:57 am    Post subject: Plato and Aristotle Reply with quote

Peter, the lover of Aristotle, claims that the idea of the number 1 must never truly escape its surroundings. Perhaps this means above 1, and bellow 2. However, for Plato and myself the numbers are ideas. Yet, they have a more subtle defect, there are more than one number 1. And each one, unlike in Peter and Aristotle, can live apart from all else. Each is perfect, as is the Platonic true trawler after fish, a trawler seeking after fish is a true idea, that can live apart from any instance. Yet, it is only itself, and not several true ideas of a trawler.

Even though Peter and Aristotle hate the truth, one must not be dissuaded and dulled of heart, but with manful courage try again to discover this truth. Now, even if all Dodo are dead, does not the idea live in the eternal cosmos?
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Peter Blumsom

Joined: 09 Mar 2007
Posts: 1167
Location: Wembley, London, UK

PostPosted: Wed Apr 24, 2019 9:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

David, it has taken you quite some time to concoct and manoeuvre this opposition to my own line of enquiry. The problem is, I agree with David and Plato and therefore disagree with Aristotle and Peter, even though you would say that I disagree with myself. Yet maybe your plan was to stir me into action and you have succeeded.

There is something in which we are not entirely in agreement, and that eventually might turn out to be everything. I hope you are not mistaking units for numbers. If numbers count the units we then have to ask if there are 'higher grade' units aiding this count. This, as you know, leads to a kind of 'third man' absurdity which confuses subject and object and downgrades the serious nature of the study.

Let's put it reasonably in the kind of framework Socrates might have been using in Phaedo and Philebus. For there to be an infinity (of 'ones') there has to be a 'many'. That 'many' is indeterminate until counted. For there to be a count there has to be a dyad comprising of 'odd' and 'even' for each is odd but both are even. However to have an odd and an even there has to be the odd one.

However, is this one a unit or is it Unity - is it one or One? Can we talk of a multiplicity of Ones?

This naturally leads to more discussion.
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David Tang

PostPosted: Sun Apr 28, 2019 9:30 pm    Post subject: One is not one. Reply with quote

Almost certainly, as a good Aristotelian, who considers "logic" of little worth, and empiricism, looking about here, here, and here, worthy, you must admit that unity and one are not the same. Since, even language, which has a marked preference for predication, says: Unity is one idea. One, too, is one of the ideas.

Now, it's true that if we slavishly follow the law of thought called excluded middle, what "is not one", includes a great deal, including "many". Yet, perhaps it even includes "one". Perhaps one is not one. This is the saying in accordance with Goethe and Heraclitus. The river spring must flow in order to be.


One unit. One counted pragmata. One 12. Two 12s. Different ways to use one? One and not many as statement prior to artificial addition of the laws of thought.
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